In Russian

On line interview with Manvel Sargsyan, ex-adviser to the NKR President,
ACNIS expert

OpenArmenia: On your opinion, what is necessary to do in Armenia in order to
provide a better life conditions? What Armenians abroad need to feel more
comfortable?

Manvel Sargsyan: I think that the majority of people in Armenia experience the
lack of fair improvement of their lives. As for the Armenians dispersed in whole
world, this issue is more complicated. Most likely, Armenians abroad feel the
lack of new events, developments which will satisfy their humane dignity. In
historical background, the problem of the vulnerability of the national dignity
significantly disturbs.

OpenArmenia: How you would asses Serzh Sargsyan? Will he be able to carry the
laborious burden properly?

Manvel Sargsyan: Serzh Sargsyan came to the power by very complicated and
dangerous means. In such cases, position of the President is unsteady. Today
Sargsyan has more problems within the camp of the power than in the relations
with the opposition. The authorities of Armenia today have no chances for
stabile functioning. If Serzh realize this, he should change everything. Very
soon it will be clear whether he wants and capable of making changes.

OpenArmenia: Unfortunately I am not familiar with your biography, but I assume
that you worked with Arkadi Ghukasyan. Are the principles of governance (I am
not talking about shifts within the staff) differing from the principles of Bako
Sahakyan? To my opinion, Bako is a harsher politic even when it concerns the
Nagorno Karabakh  conflict settlement.

Manvel Sargsyan: Ghukasyan and Bako
Sahakyan came to the power under very different circumstances. By demolition of
the Samvel Babayan’s regime, Ghukasyan gained a considerable reserve of trust.
The harsh regime of Babayan quickly evoked nihilism in the NKR society. Thus,
Ghukasyan easily was implementing his plans; he didn’t face any problems for
years. There were no altercations neither regarding economic nor social
policies. Each cent that was invested in Karabakh  was perceived as a “great achievement of the President”. Only by the
end of Ghukasyan’s regime the nihilism towards the power sharply increased.

In this background Bako Sahakyan appeared on the post of the NKR President in
2007. During the pre-election campaign he made so many promises that already
today society has many questions to him. Especially this concerns his manpower
policy. Nobody can understand its logic. However, there is still a willingness
to understand.

Sahakyan has also another difficulty. Ghukasyan was perceived as a good diplomat
and often was able to distract the attention of the public from the acute social
problems and focus on the foreign policy issues. This will be difficult for Bako
Sahakyan because nobody expects from him anything essential in the settlement of
the political problem of NKR as he did not promise anything in this respect.

OpenArmenia: Could you say more about the myth of “impingement” of Babayan on
Ghukasyan or as typical for Karabakh style, you would say that nothing has
happened.

Manvel Sargsyan: If the problem of “impingement” is transparent enough for you,
I have nothing to add to this old story.

OpenArmenia: To what extent one who knows a lot or considers himself as someone
who knows a lot, may be optimistic?

I think the question is really proper. Is there a person in Armenia whom you
would trust the issue?

Manvel Sargsyan: Everything depends on the issue, what about you want to be
optimistic? There are differences, it depends if we are talking about Serzh
Sargsyan’s destiny or about the perspectives of development of Armenia.
Particularly, the problems of Armenia within the country and outside are
perceived differently. Even more, very often the opinions are opposite. It is
natural: Armenian outside Armenia wants to hear only about stabile and
positively perceived homeland.

However within the country the citizens value other things. Everyone wants to be
proud of the country not only because Sirusho attained good results on the
international contest or the Armenian football team won a game with a worthy
rival, but also to be proud because of the quality of the citizen’s life.
Political leaders are valued not because they are harsh with the Azerbaijanis or
Turks on the international arena; they are valued because of the real steps
directed to the development of the country.

In this respect, there is still the optimism in Armenia. Existing situation has
already exhausted its potential. If the ruling elite choose the course of
maintenance of current situation, it will destroy itself together with the
system of values and realities. If it realizes the situation, it will support
progressive changes. In both cases Armenia will overcome the obstacles and
problems. Thus, it is better to think not about the destiny of the certain
political power but about the destiny of the changes.

OpenArmenia: To your opinion, what does it mean “fair improvement of their
lives”?

Manvel Sargsyan: In the modern world people consider the improved life as a
principle of equal possibilities, protection and responsibility. This may be
obtained by the strengthening of the atmosphere of legality in the state.
Citizens of the modern Armenia want the same, what else?

OpenArmenia: Why even in such a small country as NKR there is a corruption.

Manvel Sargsyan: For the same reason as everywhere: politics who take up certain
posts very often turn it to the mechanism which provides their personal life.

OpenArmenia: I would like to know your opinion about the Nagorno
Karabakh  conflict
settlement: OSCE document, surrender of the freed territories?

Manvel
Sargsyan: I only know that in NKR nobody is going to return anything. As
for discussing document, I don’t have a serious attitude. The problem is that
long lasting and vain negotiations creates a negative attitude. This have
happened with the OSCE Minsk Group proposal

OpenArmenia: As I know, you are familiar with Mais Mailyan. According to your
information, is Mailyan going to continue his political career? Did he support
the Armenian opposition?

Manvel Sargsyan: We are friends with Mais. And now, as far as I know, he is
actively interested in all political processes. Is he going to continue the
political activity, it is hard to say. Ask him yourself.

OpenArmenia: While reading your previous answers, I have noticed the absence of
optimism which is typical for Karabakh people, especially regarding the Nagorno
Karabakh 
settlement issue. Am I wrong or the situation is really sad?

Manvel
Sargsyan: It is absolutely not sad. Everything depends on the fact how
you evaluate the state of things in the diplomacy of the settlement. To my
opinion, this is a natural process, not worthy to highlight its importance more
than it should be. The country should learn how to find solutions of its
strategic problems. Once NKR found solutions of the military problems, then it
seemed there were little chances for success and that too much time passed.
However life proved that if the spirit is high all problems may be solved. The
same is now- if there is a goal and willingness to invest energy to obtain this
goal, the results will follow.

OpenArmenia: What is your opinion about Tigran Hayrapetyan? What is your
attitude towards his public activities?

Manvel Sargsyan: I knew Tigran well. I think he was one of the sober-minded
political scientists and very optimistic person. It is pity to loose people like
him.

OpenArmenia: What do you think, what plans had Robert Kocharyan before
Ter-Petrosyan started active political work and how his plans modified in
future? And to your opinion, what are the goals of Kocharyan now?

Manvel
Sargsyan: In countries like Armenia the resignation for high level
officials always is a problem. In some countries the politics didn’t resign by
their own will. Thus, Kocharyan’s problem related to the situation which he
faced. In such cases, usually each resigning official is trying to peacefully
substitute himself by a faithful and devoted to him person. The same tried to do
Kocharyan and this was his great mistake, I think. The situation in Armenia was
different. In general, the idea of substitution never ever was justified
elsewhere.

Now, Serzh Sargsyan rather should think about his own destiny than about the
destiny of a person who put him on the post of President. It is naïve to think
that Kocharyan realizes well what he should do further. Probably he just thinks.

Thank you. I should go now. I will answer your other questions later.

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